Can someone id these EPI's?

[Kegger]

Actually the xover is behind the 8" driver and is easier to see by pulling that driver.

No I have optimus 40's, no mach I's and mine are a little high end shy but get great
bass/mid and I think mine would add in a bad way, but I'd love to see pic's of your's!
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Well I redid the second set's xover with a single 12.5uf cap on the tweeter, (figured
they originally had a 15uf and the humanspeakers site says 10uf so split and use 12.5) (good quality poly's with a pio bypass)
and I have a pair of 8" woofs from a pair of advents then use an old utah 12" paper
surround woof as the passive with a pair of borrowed EPI tweeters from Andyman and
the second set sounds better then the first. I ran the positive lead through the switch
first, then the cap, then the tweeter, so the switch does not affect impeadence.
(I had a friend come by and asked him to listen to both sets without telling him what it
was I had done and he picked the second set fairly resounding)

There's less bass (but still plenty) but more midrange precence and more air to the top
end. The originals are slightly laid back and recessed on the vocals with a tad heavy in
the bass region and not as much sparkle on the top end. That is being extremely picky
on the speaker but if I was to try and improve them those would be the areas to work
on. Now it is quite possable by renewing the xover and putting the original passive back
in the first pair may clear up all of the slightly sub par performance I'm hearing but even
in the state there in, still a wonderful sounding, very musical speaker combined with an
amp that has great character also it will let the amp shine through.

Very cool speakers!

 

[krazyknuc]

Hmmmm.....
Trying to decide if I really like this configuration.
But it sure looks cool !!!
I'll try to get to that Xover tomorrow, been a long day that started at 4 am.
Hope you like the pictures.

 

[krazyknuc]

Woofer Out/Crossover Nudie Pics

OK
I won't bother deciphering these notations, you should be able to read em from the pics.
It all looks unfiddled and original.
The three grey caps all have the same value.
My woofers and passives have all been refoamed within the last 3 years, I bought them that way off ebay from revaud in Toronto.
Do yours have this wonky foam insulation stuff in them too ?
Never seen this kind before.
I'm not sure what was going on with your's with the different caps but I hope this helps.

 

[Kegger]

Yep that's the same configuration, 2 10uf caps in series (gives you 5uf) then a 10uf
cap in paralell with those (gives you a total of 15 uf) and it's connected to the neg
which puts the caps first then the switch then the driver (coming from the neg side)
which means when you have the switch in any position but normal you are changing
the amount of resistance the cap see's which will inturn lower the xover point!

If you use the switch to tame the high's (which I doubt) then I would rewire that setup.
If you ever decide to recap the xover with poly's instead of the crappy old electrolytics
then I would definatly redo the wiring so the switch can actually function properly!
If you do recap it you may get the better tweeter performance you seek!

 

[krazyknuc]

It sounds like you know what you're doing, umm, unlike me....
You're right, I leave the toggles to normal (whatever that is ).
My electronics expertise is fairly limited (pronounced practically non-existant ): household wiring, common sense and what I glean from here such as knowing how to determine my dc offset is screwed but not knowing how to remedy it without service manuals, deoxiting switches and pots, basic soldering (thanks for the tips Bolly :thmbsp: ), Marantz 2270 bulb replacement (thanks again Bolly !!!), etc.
I have also been told that my electronics knowledge is connected from my eyes to my wallet....I see pretty 70's stereo stuff and out comes my wallet..... :yes:
I was thinking of ordering a set of the crossovers that Hugh sells on human speakers.
I would appreciate your opinion of them and how you feel they fair with your statement?

 

[Kegger]

I did not see a xover on the human site, I will go there now to see what I can find.

But to be honest I don't know what he'd be selling as there's just a cap in the xover
on the tweeter in series with it.

Heck if that's all it is I'll sell yu some caps I got with directions on how to do it.
(And mine will more then likely be much better then what he sells)

But I will look to see what he's doing.

 

[krazyknuc]

It's there somewhere, I'll try to take a look later today if there's time.
He supplies a new crossover and plate with the caps, new 5 way gold plated binding posts and wiring to proper length (I assume a switch too).
I don't know enough about this to be able to converse with Hugh about it and I'm not sure he states exactly how it's wired or if it's different than original.
I don't know if you are comfortable with sending him an email addressing the crossover issue, but I think it may help, especially if he responds .
Maybe someone else has some knowledge of this crossover issue.

 

[luvvinvinyl]

On Huw's site, go to the DIY section, then 'Pricing'. Scroll down to the bottom of the list. Items 'ACC xxx' are what you seek.

Not commenting on price/quality, merely providing site location.

 

[Kegger]

Yah I sent him an email a few days ago with no response as of yet.

I found the xover deal (Thanks Ernie) and if you feel the "new crossover and plate with the caps, new 5 way gold plated
binding posts and wiring to proper length" are worth it for you I see nothing glaring as a bad thing. And you can allways
rewire it if it does not go through the switch or go through it properly. But it's nothing more then some decent caps for
the xover it'self which is doable on your own unless you want all the other stuff, which you may.

It's there somewhere, I'll try to take a look later today if there's time.
He supplies a new crossover and plate with the caps, new 5 way gold plated binding posts and wiring to proper length (I assume a switch too).
I don't know enough about this to be able to converse with Hugh about it and I'm not sure he states exactly how it's wired or if it's different than original.
I don't know if you are comfortable with sending him an email addressing the crossover issue, but I think it may help, especially if he responds .
Maybe someone else has some knowledge of this crossover issue.

 

[krazyknuc]

Hmmmm........
It's not like I'm made of money.....and....the more I save on repairs/mods, the more I have to actually buy stuff to repair....I mean listen to
OK, I have heard that the internal wires in these old speakers are better off replaced with something better and heavier, not to mention those crappy spring loaded terminals (I can see what a crappy connection these make), and then of course there is the caps that are definately better off replaced with the newer type.
Would it be necessary to replace the board or can all this be done using the same board?
I might require a little bit of direction on this, hope you don't mind.

 

[Kegger]

Yes you could do it all yourself and use the original board.

I've done one of mine but not the binding posts yet.

When I do my binding posts I can put pic's here and a short "HOW TO" about it.

 

[krazyknuc]

Well, I'm very strongly considering it.
I may have to check the FAQs or send my own email to Huw (thanks for the correct spelling luvvinvinyl) and get his opinion.
I have to practice up my soldering skills.
I have questions regarding the quality/type of wire and connectors.
Right now I am using pretty standard interconnects (cheap Princess Auto gold plated ones) and a 12 guage copper speaker wire.
How much differenct does all this fancy (pronounced "Expensive") speaker wire and interconnects make ???
Confused but willing to learn !?!

 

[Kegger]

Well, I'm very strongly considering it.
I may have to check the FAQs or send my own email to Huw (thanks for the correct spelling luvvinvinyl) and get his opinion.
I have to practice up my soldering skills.
I have questions regarding the quality/type of wire and connectors.
Right now I am using pretty standard interconnects (cheap Princess Auto gold plated ones) and a 12 guage copper speaker wire.
How much differenct does all this fancy (pronounced "Expensive") speaker wire and interconnects make ???
Confused but willing to learn !?!

Well all wire does have certain sounds and tendencies to them but you don't "need" to spend a fortune
on it and not all wire is best for every system. So just get some decent larger gauge wire, maybe 14-16
for the rewiring of the speaker if your going to do it yourself and some decent interconnects for this setup.

I've found that the wire for outdoor lighting at like home depot and such is great speaker wire for a great price.

 

[krazyknuc]

I have been using this 12 guage wire I purchase from the $0.99 Depot.
I think it is $15 for 100 ft. of what looks to be decent quality, as good as anything Shadio Rack sells that isn't Oxygen Free (how important is Oxygen Free anyways).
What about interconnects on TT's ???

 

[Kegger]

From what I've read all copper wire is at least 97% oxygen free by the smelting process
now used to manufacture the copper.

There are a ton of thoughts on the cable/interconnect/capacitor theory/use.

(Here is my view, do with it what you feel pertinent)
All equipment should be of simular quality in a system, in other words if you have one
piece that is quite down in quality to the rest it will bring the whole system down. But
the oppisite is also true, if you have one great piece it will be held back by the rest of
the system and wiring is no different. IMHO (Synergy is the key)

So there is no need to have a killer or truly expensive piece of cable on a systyem that
does not need nor apppreciate it. I would say the systems were talking about here fall
in the mid grade line with a vintage solid state receiver and some decent EPI speakers.
So the extra low level detail that a truly highend cable "may" deliver will more then likely
not be supplied by the receiver nor reproduced by the speakers so any decent cable like
the blue AR stuff you will find at Best Buy and such, or some of the better Monster stuff
should be just fine, also Blue Jean cable is suppose to have some well priced nice cables.

If you want to splurge a little, I like the green XLO cables (there lowest grade) for a step
above the generally decent grade cable. Because cables can be so user dependant and
very expensive I have not experimented with a ton of them but I do like the XLO and then
the Home Depot/Lowes outdoor lighting wire for speakers.

I really don't want to get into a cable discussion on the main board, they can get quite out
of hand. There is a new forum for cables on here though and you may want to seek it out.

Hope that was some help!

 

[krazyknuc]

I was figuring that the "middle quality" system I have might not reflect the difference a better quality cable might produce.
My cd ppayer is pretty much entry level for Rotel.
I think I will try to get in on the next round of "cable swap" activity to see what kind of differences cables/speaker wire might make.
Do you know how long approximately copper wire production has been using this process?
I'm not sure when this .99 Depot wire was manufactured.
This place sells items purchased in bulk, generally from bankrupt businesses, for really cheap.
The "packager" of the wire is HRS-Global, I'm guessing they're not the manufacturer. (gee....all this typing for $ store wire....) .

Thanks for the info :thmbsp:

 

[krazyknuc]

I was just reviewing this thread and it looks like I missed the one with you trying the Andyman tweeters.
Are these new tweeters that Huw built/rebuilt ????
And if so, do you think the newer tweeters are any better than the original ones.
Is that where the "more midrange precence and more air to the top
end" comes from, or is it the crossover changes ???

 

[Kegger]

I believe the processing of the wire has been done that way for like the last 20 years
but I'm not sure though. So yours is probably fine.

No the tweeter was just another stock EPI tweeter. The changes I heard were from
using a different woofer "newer advent" and the better caps on the tweeter made a
real nice improvement over the stock electrolytics.

I used 2 different but good quality poly's of like an 8uf and 4uf in paralell to get 12uf
then I added a paper in oil .5uf cap in paralell with those to get me 12.5uf, the value
in between 10uf what the humanspeakers site says and the original 15uf.

Overall with the extra midrange I believe the advent woofer produces and the new caps
it was a really good combination that yeilded a nice improvement, at least when used in
conjunction with my 300B tube amp. YMMV

 

[sydsfloyd67]

The thing about a properly implemented EPI-Burhoe module speaker actually is that it cannot be upgraded really, nor even beat really at any price. This was clearly a problem for Epicure/Genesis in the industry, as they established a superior and inexpensive speaker early on, and as a rare honest outfit, found themselves without any good marketing scam to go with as an 'upgrade'. (ie. 'instantaneous delivery dynamic response low oxide rare earth element cable').

Unless one has more insight than Winsloe, it's quite unlikely that anyone will find some missing patch for his speakers that will to do anything except detract from simple excellence. Note that his most popular designs have essentially "no" crossover at all -and that is what sets them apart from all the others.

As Bully says "Enjoy your vintage gear" -sf

 

[Kegger]

The thing about a properly implemented EPI-Burhoe module speaker actually is that it cannot be upgraded really, nor even beat really at any price.

Unless one has more insight than Winsloe, it's quite unlikely that anyone will find some missing patch for his speakers that will to do anything except detract from simple excellence. Note that his most popular designs have essentially "no" crossover at all -and that is what sets them apart from all the others. -sf

While I respect this speaker and the designer "EVERYTHING CAN BE UPGRADED"!
And the few people who heard my quick little whipped together of the advent driver and modded xover can attest to that.

Sometimes designers have a certain thing they are going for or have to build to a price point so seeking out the little things
that can be reworked on a piece of gear or speaker can be quite rewarding in the outcome of it's performance and maybe it
can be tailored more towards your preference or accociated gear to where it can work better.

Sure you may stumble now and then to, and not do any good on your tweaking/upgrading plan but as long as the piece isn't
hacked what does it hurt? Nothing in my mind and well worth messing with if you have the skills.