cpt_paranoia
Addicted Member
Both are acceptable, in the sense of making less strong.
I carefully dried my sand, though...
KEF owners thread
- Thread starter matteos
- Start date
I carefully dried my sand, though...
Hello James and other KEF owners,
I have a question for those members that have experience with vintage KEF reference speakers and amplifiers. In my specific case I am looking to purchase a vintage Perreaux PMF 3150 amp and have it serviced and recapped to use with my Kef 107s.
From what I have read in some threads the combination of KEF and Perreaux were very desirable back when they were new, would this be a recommended path? My other option is to hunt for an Bryston 4B sst2 or 4B3 but they are quite a bit more than the Perreaux and I am not sure that the SQ will equal the extra dollars spent for a vintage system.
Any feedback is greatly appreciated!
Thanks
Don
Looking at the specs for the Perreaux PMF 3150, it seems you've got a VERY good 350w/ch class A-B power amp there with a damping factor of 400 and low distortion. Use it and enjoy it!
Thanks for the feedback Ken, I am kind of leaning towards making the plunge on the Perreaux. I am hoping @Raynald and maybe @canuckaudiog will see this thread and chime in as I believe they have intimate experience with both the KEF and the Perreaux.
I think it might be a tough choice between a vintage Perreaux and keeping my vintage 2 X NAD 2700 THX amps. I will need to have any of them serviced and recapped but I am thinking it might be more advantageous to go with the Perreaux then the NADs even though the NADs are a fair amount newer. From a service standpoint it would be only recapping one Perreaux vs 2 NADs, altlhough when looking at the age I think I am looking at 1986 vs 1992.
Hey Dony
I’d have serious reservations buying an amp 35+ years and then finding a qualified technician to overhaul it. Big and heavy, shipping costs could be substantial. I’d also would want to know about the availability of those MOFETS in case of an issue.
I’ve been using a Bryston 3B for years. It has never been serviced with thousands of hours on it.
Still dead quiet. The factory supports mostly everything they’ve built. I’ve used other amps both tube and solid state on my REF102s but the Bryston makes the REF 103/3s come alive.
Good luck
I’d have serious reservations buying an amp 35+ years and then finding a qualified technician to overhaul it. Big and heavy, shipping costs could be substantial. I’d also would want to know about the availability of those MOFETS in case of an issue.
I’ve been using a Bryston 3B for years. It has never been serviced with thousands of hours on it.
Still dead quiet. The factory supports mostly everything they’ve built. I’ve used other amps both tube and solid state on my REF102s but the Bryston makes the REF 103/3s come alive.
Good luck
Hi Dobieguy,
Thanks for your comments regarding reservations about buying 35+ year amps. I know that sourcing a newer Bryston such as a 4B SST2 or 4B3 is a less risky approach.
However, I do know a couple local vintage technicians that can definitely service the NAD 2700 THX and other amplifiers such as McIntosh, Classe Audio, Sansui, Pioneer, Kenwood, HK, Perreaux, Nikko, Hafler, Conrad Johnson, Bryston, and many others.
I think I may have a discussion with the one of the technicians to get his feedback about servicing and re-capping a Perreaux 3150 and any issues with the MOSFETS before I decide to go thru with the purchase. I know the Brystons are reliable but they are also significantly more expensive to buy and if they are also older then they will also need servicing and re-capping at some point in time.
Hawkeye83
Super Member
Anyone here ever heard KEF 207's? I have 107's. I'm sure 207's are "better" (or at least measure better?) - but how much? They sure don't come up for sale often.
I'm happy with the 107's but if the opportunity arises to try out 207's or Blades at a "good" price, I'll likely give 'em a try. Can always resell either one for litte/no loss, I'm sure.
I'm happy with the 107's but if the opportunity arises to try out 207's or Blades at a "good" price, I'll likely give 'em a try. Can always resell either one for litte/no loss, I'm sure.
KEF Model 101
Blog High-Fidelity Stereo. Vintage Audio and Hi-Fi Equipment, info, specifications, descriptions,
stereonomono.blogspot.com
KEF's tend to sound best with high power/high current amps. And, with the 101's low efficiency (81db) you're going to need some juice behind them to get them to shine. As such, I'd recommend separates (amp/preamp). I drive my 104/2's with B&K ex4420 amp, and Schiit Saga preamp. There are many used amps out there that would easily fit the bill for these speakers. You might read through this thread to find out what others are using.
Vincent-C
New Member
Thanks very much for your helpful reply, and I will definitely be reading through the whole thread.Pay no attention to the 20-100w power recommendation. You could drive them with a 500w amp and be just fine, so long as you don't crank it to the point of distorting the sound. And, although they do have built in overload protection, I wouldn't push it to find out if it really works.KEF Model 101
Blog High-Fidelity Stereo. Vintage Audio and Hi-Fi Equipment, info, specifications, descriptions,
KEF's tend to sound best with high power/high current amps. And, with the 101's low efficiency (81db) you're going to need some juice behind them to get them to shine. As such, I'd recommend separates (amp/preamp). I drive my 104/2's with B&K ex4420 amp, and Schiit Saga preamp. There are many used amps out there that would easily fit the bill for these speakers. You might read through this thread to find out what others are using.
Yes, these speakers need some oomph!
Congratulations on your new to you KEF! Long time owner here. Forty years is a long wait, you don’t want to jeopardize them with the wrong electronics. I’ve powered mine with SS (Bryston, Levinson, Counterpoint) and tubes (Scott, Fisher).
None disappointed. Quality over quantity works best with these. I’m not sure what you mean by oomph. If you’re expecting them to deliver thunder you‘ve got the wrong speakers. Damage the tweeters and you’ve got bookends. The overload circuit is a known problem area.
Read everything on AK (also Pinkfishmedia.net) pertaining to these and all the LS3/5a threads.
Put them on good, solid stands out in your room and be prepared to be amazed!
Happy listening
James
None disappointed. Quality over quantity works best with these. I’m not sure what you mean by oomph. If you’re expecting them to deliver thunder you‘ve got the wrong speakers. Damage the tweeters and you’ve got bookends. The overload circuit is a known problem area.
Read everything on AK (also Pinkfishmedia.net) pertaining to these and all the LS3/5a threads.
Put them on good, solid stands out in your room and be prepared to be amazed!
Happy listening
James
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Vincent-C
New Member
Thanks for another very useful comment, James! All well taken, and I have no expectations of thunder from the 101s;
just want them to have the power they need to sing a bit. I definitely do not want to blow out the T27s! I have them on
30" high stands, 19" from the back wall and well away from the side walls right now- still experimenting.
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Hello fellow KEF owners,
I wanted to ask if anyone has replaced their KEF K-UBE with a MiniDsp or similar type device? My KEF 107 KUBE has recently developed some channel cut out issues in that when I first start up my system I need to engage/disengage the monitor tape/source button on the back of the KUBE repeatively in order for both channels to operate properly.
Once both channels engage as required then it seems to work fine until I restart my system. I suspect it is a faulty tape/source monitor switch and unfortunately I think the part is an unobtainium as the K-UBE is approximately 38 years old. I recently had the K-UBE recapped and had new opamps installed thinking that repair might fix the issue, I've also deoxited the monitor switch but unfortunately the problem persists.
Thus, I think my next best option would be to purchase a Minidsp 2X4 HD and use it to control the overall EQ curve for my KEF 107. Anyone have any recommendations or comments about this approach?
Thanks
Don
I wanted to ask if anyone has replaced their KEF K-UBE with a MiniDsp or similar type device? My KEF 107 KUBE has recently developed some channel cut out issues in that when I first start up my system I need to engage/disengage the monitor tape/source button on the back of the KUBE repeatively in order for both channels to operate properly.
Once both channels engage as required then it seems to work fine until I restart my system. I suspect it is a faulty tape/source monitor switch and unfortunately I think the part is an unobtainium as the K-UBE is approximately 38 years old. I recently had the K-UBE recapped and had new opamps installed thinking that repair might fix the issue, I've also deoxited the monitor switch but unfortunately the problem persists.
Thus, I think my next best option would be to purchase a Minidsp 2X4 HD and use it to control the overall EQ curve for my KEF 107. Anyone have any recommendations or comments about this approach?
Thanks
Don
I used a miniDSp on some 103/3 speakers a few years ago. You just need the EQ curve from the Kube and do a bit of work in the DSP to copy it. I slso used a graphic EQ app in my PC music server which worked very well. A 1/3 octave graphic equalizer can do the job too.
Hi nerdorama,
Thanks for your reply.
I'm thinking that I can use a MiniDSP 2X4 HD with the UMIK-1 microphone to capture the EQ curve from the KEF 107 with the K-UBE engaged since I can still make the K-UBE work with some finessing. Once I have the K-UBE curve capture then I can use the curve file to duplicate the EQ curve file into something that can be manipulated/fine tuned within the MiniDSP console or within REW/ Dirac Live for any further necessary enhancements.
I know it probably won't be as good as the original EQ curve of the KEF K-UBE, however it will have to do as I don't think I could manage to obtain a EQ curve file from the 38 year old Kef K-UBE unless I'm incredibility lucky and someone has that information to share.
As you mentioned I also could look into a graphic equalizer with a spectrum analyzer to possibly recreate the curve that the K-UBE produces but that maybe less accurate than the MiniDSP as I don't believe the microphones used in the old graphic eqs would be as accurate as the UMIK-1 or UMIK-2 that are currently available.
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idf.bts
Well-Known Member
I have 3 sets of 107s and sold all 3 Kubes to members here about 2 years ago, they were sitting for like a decade. I never used the KUBE, I could always solve issues with room placement.
The issue you are reporting seems fixable. A component may be hard to obtain, but something like a switch is relatively interchangeable, its just may not look identical.
I don't think a microphone is your best option but you can measure the speakers without the KUBE EQ and then program the miniDSP to flatten the dips and peaks. If you want to download REW, Room EQ Wizard, and learn to use it you can generate an EQ file that will download directly to the miniDSP.
Does anyone know what the KUBE does for the 107? It may only be a bass boost in which case you don't really need it. There are many ways to accomplish a low frequency boost. My 103/3 KUBE performed a pretty wild EQ, a lot more that just a bass boost. They were very un-flat with it. This was the EQ from the 103/3 KUBE:
Does anyone know what the KUBE does for the 107? It may only be a bass boost in which case you don't really need it. There are many ways to accomplish a low frequency boost. My 103/3 KUBE performed a pretty wild EQ, a lot more that just a bass boost. They were very un-flat with it. This was the EQ from the 103/3 KUBE:
idf.bts
Well-Known Member
Contour is a bass boost below 160Hz, up to 3db.
Extension is a low frequency cutoff. Q factor changes LF damping, thought I don't know much about how it does that.
Set contour first, then the other 2.
Hi idf.bts,
Thanks for your reply about the KEF Kubes and the fact that room placement can be used to solve issues. The issue I am reporting is likely repairable if I find the right technician and he/she can source the correct switch. However, that maybe an approach that may have unknown results, efforts, and costs. At least if I pursue the MiniDSP solution then I know I can work with it and it will function as intended if I put enough effort into creating the custom EQ file to match the original EQ curve of the K-UBE. An additional feature is that I can create and customize the curve to my room acoustics and store it for use and retrieval indefinitely. That is not a feature or option that I would have with a restored K-UBE.
Hi nerdorama,
Nice that you have the EQ curve from the 103/3 Kube to work from. Unfortunately I don't have that from the KEF 107. The attached info. is from the KEF 107 users manual so it indicates there are two EQ features the K-UBE provides, one fixed and one variable.
