The bigger the horn, the better the horn. Not a salesman, but an "order taker" Big difference!
new Klipsch Jubilee
- Thread starter bolero
- Start date
In other words, you have friends with experience and are another typing/parroting spec. sheet.
Paul was not an original thinker, but a slow, progressive one. I experienced a full day with him at his home, listning to his recordings, factory, 2 meals, and shots of Glenfiddich. Amazing what you can learn in a full day of conversation. A live, color, and 3D experience.
The new Jubilee is Roy's "ode to Paul." Regardless of how much credit he takes. He did all the work on the speakers, and specified the Electronics, since Paul has been dead for over 20 years, so it's all Senor Delgado's work.
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Coytee
Super Member
A point of clarification if I may.... and this presumes I'm understanding you correctly to suggest the early Jubilee's didn't have signal alignment and the new ones do.
This would be incorrect. Though I can't say what the design goal was when started.... Roy put these out as an actively crossed, signal aligned speaker. He auditioned them (using signal aligned active) for some Bozo's one year....and heard chatter "Gee, those sound fantastic...but that +#$@*#$@ active crossover.... "if ONLY they were passive, then yeah (puffs their chest out) I'd buy a pair"
So the following year, (2007). I arrived early only to find Roy having the Jubilee in their chamber as he was refining the passive crossover for it since that's what all those Bozo's wanted to hear. Here is a picture I took during this very process as he had the speaker in the chamber. He cobbed a passive together.... played them and again, the crowd was wowed. Then, a couple of boneheads took action and bought a pair.... USING AN ACTIVE!!
Roy made a comment to me a year or two later at a follow-up "Jubefest" and was shaking his head.... he muttered (paraphrased) "I don't get it... I play them with an active to make them sound as good as they can.... the crowd wants a passive. So, the following year, I design a passive....and what does the crowd do? They buy them with an active"
So his intent and design was for them to be used with a signal aligned active.....but went out of his way to create a passive for those boneheads who wanted to hit the 'easy' button.
HPower
Active Member
Hey Dave,
I was down your way a couple weeks ago and dropped into Parts Conx and got about the same type of brief demo as you did.
I thought what I heard was TERRIBLE!
The salesman was so keen to show how the Xover could be adjusted, more than listening to what they sounded like
IMHO, these Jubs never started with the correct settings and then got to the correct settings.
I took great care (with the expert help of ChrisA) to set both my previous Jub-likes and current Peavey/402s up with the best settings on my Xilica XP 4080.
This involved measuring the speakers with a mic and REW software with, 2 or 3 rounds before both Chris and I were happy.
For someone to just loosy goosy fiddle with the controls in a demo, has no idea what these new Heritage Jubs can actually do... and should not touch!
Yes the room there is not ideal, but my room at home could be better as well, I and I have MUCH better sound in my basement.
I was down your way a couple weeks ago and dropped into Parts Conx and got about the same type of brief demo as you did.
I thought what I heard was TERRIBLE!
The salesman was so keen to show how the Xover could be adjusted, more than listening to what they sounded like
IMHO, these Jubs never started with the correct settings and then got to the correct settings.
I took great care (with the expert help of ChrisA) to set both my previous Jub-likes and current Peavey/402s up with the best settings on my Xilica XP 4080.
This involved measuring the speakers with a mic and REW software with, 2 or 3 rounds before both Chris and I were happy.
For someone to just loosy goosy fiddle with the controls in a demo, has no idea what these new Heritage Jubs can actually do... and should not touch!
Yes the room there is not ideal, but my room at home could be better as well, I and I have MUCH better sound in my basement.
Like I said: "Order Takers" vs. real knowledgeable sales people.
Which could have been "Photoshopped OUT" sez the man who used to be a Beta Tester for Lightroom and Photoshop. The word has evolved from a noun, naming a Pixel level software application, to a modern verb of action. LOL.
Great post. I was there too. Yes Roy also impressed Paul Klipsch when he went active on the Khorns and time aligned them too!
One of my best friends, now retired home builder, has a terrific wood shop with all the tools. He only builds Direct Radiator speakers, and is "dig my heels in the dirt" about the MYTH, that passive "sound better." He has a large collection of Coils and Capacitors in huge metal cabinets in climate controlled basement, across from several of his past speakers, that would easily sell for $20,000 to $60,000 at Axpona.
I sent him down the Open Baffle journey 12 years ago, and he has not come back to Horns (he had LaScalas almost 50 years ago and I helped him build Monkey Coffin Subwoofer for it)............. so, there is still hope.
Each his passive networkstakes6 months to a year to tune to his terrific/beautiful sound ROOM. I just think Horns are above his pay grade and hates it when he hears mine sounding better than his, and won't admit it. Ego and "always right" mentality is part of it. He is also great at choosing really good music and recordings as compensation, but I digress.
This is a widespread disease, propagated by "StereoPhool" and "Absolutely Soundless" magazines that cater to their ADVERTSERS and write Prose for a living. Basically no one believes the TRUTH, which was PWK's Silver Medal Award............MODULATION Distortion is the speaker killer, yet the lemmings still go over the cliff in the direct radiator Fog.
Like any of Society's critics, they can't "do it" so all they can do is write about it. PWK used to call them "the Lay Press" for a reason. They can really lay down the BS. every month, tirelessly.
Only in Engineering can find the Truth with most of the BS filtered out. But since engineers work for sales and marketing people in companies, they have to do what they are told and go along with SOME of the BS in order to make sales happen. Roy, as Paul's apprentice, is a NO BS type of guy and a very competent horn designer. Just sayin'.
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Invidiosulus
Well-Known Member
Flash photography often looks fake as it presents an unnatural lighting scenario that our brains don’t want to understand without a little work.
I would not call Rigma's uber expensive Passive Networks "easy" since he and Roy spent too much time finding the wiring errors in them. Easy should be assigned to Active (4 wires instead of 2) and still easier, better, AND cheaper then Passives which LACK time alignment that is super easy in modern Acitve DSP crossovers. It's much easier than SOLDERING, trust me.
Coytee
Super Member
Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!
You are going to pop the bubble.
What you say above, is of course, true. But I'm not admitting that I know that.
I guess this means I can call you "Stock boy".(HA! I've never wanted to call someone Pixel-boy!)
Single, on-camera Flash, yes, agreed.
Coytee
Super Member
I have a very good Klipsch wife. I even gave her a pair of Heresy's as part of the divorce (LOL). Time marches on.or, dumbazz, as approved by my wife as most appropriate.
Southern
Active Member
The order takers is what prevented me from spending my 'hard earned money" on a new set of Forte IV's.
twiiii
Lunatic Member
You notice how the grills are sagging on the Jubilee woofer horns. Seems Klipsch dealers are having the same struggles with most of the Heritage models they sell. I wonder if a steam iron would fix the issue they way we did back in the 60's, 70's and 80's, with Altec , JBL and Bozak speakers that would occasionally sag. Bozak Moorish models had pleats so sagging was never an issue. I would want grills over the horns. I didn't like the look of Altec Mantarays back in the 70's and I don't like these either.
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Mantarays were NOT good sounding horns. The K-402 trounces them all. Besides, the bigger the horn, the better the horn. Only luddites care about the looks. It's the SOUND we are after.
twiiii
Lunatic Member
Not in my house, you would be thrown out on your ear. It wouldn't be me doing the throwing. I would stand back and watch. Altec horns were about controlling sound dispersion for maximum gain and definition in a reverberant space. Nothing more. They needed voicing to be tolerated. But as far as looks go, the 402 and the larger Mantarays are equally ugly. So in my case they would have to be hidden behind shear curtains or behind large grill covered with porous cloth.
If I had a man cave maybe three Jubilee's behind a large projection screen for movies. and I wouldn't need subwoofers. I guess I could use Cornwalls for surround speakers. That means one MC 257 and one MC 255.
If I had a man cave maybe three Jubilee's behind a large projection screen for movies. and I wouldn't need subwoofers. I guess I could use Cornwalls for surround speakers. That means one MC 257 and one MC 255.
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